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Author Topic: Half and Half  (Read 4915 times)

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Mongo

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Half and Half
« on: September 06, 2009, 08:09:20 AM »

There are those who can come out of the closet, or for that matter have never *been* in the closet in the first place.

There are others who are stuck in the broom closet and stay there with the door shut, eyes closed, fingers in the ears going "I'm not pagan! You can't prove anything! LaLaLaLaLaLaLaLa! Not Listening"

Then there is the other group who are stuck in a weird limbo of being half in and half out of the closet. Those few who can come out of the closet on certain times...and have to run back screaming for the closet before a select few see us for we truly are.

I'm in this category myself. So is my wife for that matter. Why are we here in this weird chicken with our heads cut off, running back and forth between the closet and freedom? For many it can be differing reasons, but it all boils down to a very select few people can really mess up our lives if they knew.

In our case it is a combination of things. My wife works for a very devout Christian group of people who, while are good people, still look down on homosexuality, mixed race couples and anything they consider "evil".

One of their employees and her husband being pagan would trump all of it.

So this is one reason we have to "stay in the closet" The other reason is her family and more importantly her ex-husband. You see, they got the divorce and with his work schedule as a gym teacher in public schools, his lawyer was ably to argue that he would be best for having the custodial status in the joint custody of the children as he would have the same schedule of days off as the children. I could wax poetic for hours on the qualities (or lack thereof) of this man but this isn't the section for that.

We have to carefully duck around this man since he holds the power to grant or refuse custody should he find out of our pagan status. We live in a very southern Christian mentality (which for the large part are against mixed race couples, homosexuality, stem cell research, anything stereotypically evil in the eyes of the Church) and as such would be fuel for her ex to take her back to court and say "See! She belongs to a cult! She's not safe for the children to be left with unsupervised!" and the odds are in his favor and not ours.

Her folks would simply disown us all together since they're already treating him better than their own flesh and blood.

So...

How can one be half in and half out? Isn't there some risk of being found out? Sure there is some risk, but the name of the game is risk management. The people we're involved and who know and accept us are not the sorts of people our potential problems would even know much less associate with on any meaningful level. Our friends who know our spiritual status are in the SCA (The Society for Creative Anachronism - Also jokingly referred to as "Socially Challenged Americans ;) ).

In this group we have found acceptance as there are thousands of people walking hundreds of different paths ranging from Jewish to Christian, to the many and wildly varied flavors of Paganism.

So the point of this? I guess it would be that not everyone can stay in the closet. It can be stifling in there and we need to come out at some point. Finding a way to come out to a group that is safe will help you when you have to hide back in the closet. And lets face it. Even many of us whom are "Out of the closet"...have need to duck back in from time to time.

But we all need to breathe. We all need to get out into the fresh air once in a while. Sadly we need to duck back in, but at least for right now it is getting better out there. Not as noticeably in some areas as in others...but it is getting there slowly but surely.

M
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Ghost Wolf

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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2009, 08:54:25 AM »

I feel your pain, as a former President was wont to say. I, too, live in a highly Christian area, with a Church a stone's throw in any direction. Very few people know I am Pagan and I prefer it that way - it causes much less strife. My wife knows and chooses to ignore it, making the occasional comment about my "weird stuff," "devil worshipping books" and how much time I spend on the 'net talking to my "Mason and Witch friends" (got the monthly lecture on that one yesterday - seems I should be working an additional job part-time and "contributing." My full-time job apparently is not enough in her eyes - even though I do the cooking, cleaning, clothes washing and get Hunter ready and to school.) My Mother suspects, but the rest of my family would have a stuff-fit and disown me (all fundi Southern Christians right in line with Mongo's people).

So, staying in the closet (I hate that cliched term) is a necessity sometimes just to maintain a sane environment. I haven't had any real life Pagan friends for years - just you guys here and at the Lodge in cyberspace.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2009, 08:56:41 AM by Ghost Wolf »
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dragonspring

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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2009, 09:56:55 AM »

I'm in the same boat.  My family and close friends are the only ones who know I am Pagan. 
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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2009, 10:25:35 AM »


I'm totally out- I wear a pentacle in public, Pagan blog, etc. But when I was working for a Christian who had a Christian customer base, I didn't wear the pentacle; as it would have cost him customers, harming the whole shop, I thought it the right thing to do. When direct questions were asked- as that stripe of Christian is wont to do- I could quite truthfully say I was a member of All Souls church... thank the Goddess for the Unitarians!

As far as family goes, I never did tell my parents, but my brothers are ok with it. My wife practices with me; she's out of the closet to her family, and they're all cool. Lol- several of them are atheists; Christian or Wiccan are all the same to them.

peace,
ES
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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2009, 11:04:54 AM »

I'm also in that place that is very much in between.  The only people that know are my husband, who is not Pagan but is completely understanding and supportive of my choice, and my lovely online family.

I choose to stay this way for several reasons.  We also live in an area that it would be a very bad thing to be a known Pagan and I'm afraid for my kids.  They have enough to deal with at school with kids being mean and bully like, they don't need any more ammunition.  My husband also works with some very narrow minded people and I wouldn't put it past them to find a reason to get rid of him if they knew of my beliefs.  Throw into that mix a rather conservative family and several Jehovah's Witness family members and you have the makings for disaster.

I choose to live this way because I feel it is the best thing for all that are involved.  I do not want my kids to be the target for other peoples ignorance, prejudice and hate.  I want them to be judged based on their own merits, not what their mother believes.  I want the same for my husband and myself.

I feel that my spirituality is my business and mine alone.  It should be my choice to share it with someone or not.  I choose not.
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EarthenWanderer

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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2009, 11:27:25 AM »

The only people who know about me are the people on this forum and another. It seems to be better this way. It wouldn't work out right with my family if they knew, and I may need money when going to university, so it's not always best to rock the proverbial boat.
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Crystal Dragon

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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #6 on: September 06, 2009, 03:58:43 PM »

I guess I'd have to say I'm out of the closet.  My hubby knows, and he's fine with it ... he' even joined me in ritual a few times.  My daughter is Wiccan.  My dad knows and is fine with it ... I'm not on speaking terms with most of the rest of the family for a variety if reasons, but none of them related to my beliefs.  I wear a pentacle all the time and while I've gotten a couple of funny looks, I've only ever had one person mention it.  Basically, I don't bring up religion in conversations.  If asked, I answer honestly, but feel no need to throw my views in anothers face.
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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #7 on: September 06, 2009, 05:48:09 PM »

I am sorta in and out. I've never gone out of my way to deny what I am, but I don't go shouting it from the rooftops. Most of my family does NOT know...more peaceful that way. My mother knows, my dad did, my brother does...My MIL, FIL and SIL know...not sure about who else on that side.
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bluefire

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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2009, 09:59:44 AM »

I'm out of the closet to anyone who cares to ask.  Can't say it comes up often though.  Family celebrates sabbats with me.  Friends either accept it or don't say much, but we have had some interesting conversations too.

One woman at work made a snide comment when I put up an arrangement that included some crystals on my desk to suck up negative energy.  She asked what it was and I told her.  She made some comment about needing a goat to make it work or something.  I don't remember exactly what it was.  It struck me as funny and I laughed, then she did too.  She did come back a week later to say that "the air has lightened."  It had.  It was during a really tough time at work when a reorganization, including layoffs, was being planned but hadn't been announced yet.  The atmosphere was charged with fear and secrets.  I really believe my little crystal friends helped all who came to my desk to stay cool.  She hasn't bugged me since and has even asked more questions here or there.

I am lucky to live in a place where people pretty much stay out of one another's business.  I know it's not like that everywhere.
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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #9 on: September 07, 2009, 10:50:17 AM »

I am lucky to live in a place where people pretty much stay out of one another's business.  I know it's not like that everywhere.

Oh, how I wish it was!
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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2009, 02:49:23 PM »

That's great BF!  Of course, you'd all laugh if you saw my office at work.  Crystals all over every horizontal surface (just like at home), Pagan themed pictures here and there, my Jessica Galbraith calendar, reed diffusers, silk flowers, and stuffed animals all over the place. :rotflmao:

The last time they moved me it took 3 days to pack all my stuff, move it and unpack.  The boss let me "borrow" two technicians to move the stuff I didn't want the movers to handle.  And as I was unpacking the last box, the boss wanders over, looks around, says "you've got a lot of stuff" and walks off.  :laughfit:

And then there are the "rumors" the guy next to me started.  It was a joke between he and the big boss, but it stuck.  They're telling folks that the stuffed animals on the cabinet over my desk are actually the employees who've left the program and not been seen since.  :whistle:
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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2009, 03:13:27 PM »

And then there are the "rumors" the guy next to me started.  It was a joke between he and the big boss, but it stuck.  They're telling folks that the stuffed animals on the cabinet over my desk are actually the employees who've left the program and not been seen since.  :whistle:

That's funny.   :rotflmao:  They "went on to pursue other interests,"
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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2009, 03:20:12 PM »

 :laughfit:
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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2009, 04:05:12 PM »

I guess I'm half in half out too.  My mom knows and my dad doesn't.  My parent's are still together, but she told me that I should wait until I had made more progress on my career before I tell him because he'd think it's a 'distraction'.  I sort of got upset and asked if he'd think that if I'd converted to Christianity, and she said 'yes, of course, he thinks religion is distracting' so I guess fair enough.  My mom is really supportive though.
As for my friends, people close to me here know, and a few others because I'm a very truthful drunk sometimes.  Most aren't surprised.  They're usually like 'that seems like something you'd be into.'  My friends from back home don't know.  Not that they'd be rude about it but when I was younger I used to go through a lot of phases, and I want them to take it seriously if and when I tell them, so I'll probably wait a year or so when I've been practicing for a while.

As for the city, at least Berlin is a fairly liberal city and most people are atheists, so in general it's not too intimidating to tell people.  There was even a big public bonfire at midnight on My 1 at Kulturbrauerei, which is a huge arts complex with a number of night clubs and stuff in the city center. As a dress code you had to dress like a 'witch' (stereotypically obviously haha.)  Not sure if it was mostly people having fun or if a lot of real pagans showed up because I was sick that night and didn't go but it still seemed like fun.
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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2009, 01:55:32 PM »

I'm also half in half out.

My husband knows, and supports and occasionally participates.  Nobody else in the family knows.  My mom suspects and wouldnt care (nor would the rest of her family) but my mother can not keep her mouth shut about anything and anything that would make me look bad to my "christian" side of the family is what her main focus is at the time :brickwall:

Mine is mostly hidden out of respect.  I wouldnt want to break my grandmas heart because she is near and dear to me.
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Joy

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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #15 on: October 03, 2009, 11:56:42 AM »

I'm in and out. I do not broadcast it at work though it is common knowledge there. I previously worked with 2 other gals who upon learning of my path decided they "would do it to."  They did broadcast it and made a point of flaunting it, using it for all the wrong reasons. They no longer work there and I keep a low profile about things. There are just too many people who don't understand and many who sadly are frightened by it.  I am very open at home though I do not bring it up around my brother. My son told a friend about me who promptly spread it around the townhome community where were previously lived  that  I worshiped the devil. I have since advised my son to practice discretion. The friend will not sleep over at our house and is clearly frightened by the things he doesn't understand.

I do not try to hide it as I have organizers in my room filled with my herbs and candles but I will not ever be very open about it. I have just run into too many people who don't get it.
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vordan

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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #16 on: October 05, 2009, 05:24:04 PM »

I am pretty much out of the closet, seldom denying it if directly asked. I get teased about it by everybody who thinks they are witty and clever. My boss knows, his boss knows, shoot about the whole company knows. While I didn't tell more then a handful of people they delighted in spreading the gossip at work to promote their own stock. I am vague and a little evasive with some people about what I believe, I give them the edited version. Around hardcore religious folk of all faiths, I say very little that would get me in trouble. In terms of friends, people who can't accept it I don't really care if they are my friend. I have been exposed to some rather violent rednecks in my day, and am cautious. I still remember the time my dad almost got his ear cut off by a, mean as a snake, hillbilly fundie for not agreeing with him about Jesus. There are those out there who are not sane.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2009, 06:11:53 PM by vordan »
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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #17 on: October 06, 2009, 12:31:59 PM »

I am most definately out- and although I live in a very Catholic country- everyone who knows me- at work- in the town-are all ok with it- Have asked questions- showing the naievty and rubbish out there about Pagan folk. Needless to say I have  put them right- in a nice kind of way. All my family know- My Mom thought it was a faze- when I was in my teens- she said " You'll grow out of it"- He He- I'm 46 now.
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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #18 on: October 16, 2009, 07:31:21 AM »

I'd say i'm not in the closet but that doesn't mean I go parading through the streets with a pentacle the size of my face, a toad in my pocket and a broom under my arm...

I'm very open about it but only to people who ask, so my parents and friends know and some randomers who were curious... i think open discression is the best policy!
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Ameliyah

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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #19 on: December 29, 2009, 07:44:39 PM »

I guess I'm partially in and partially out... but mostly in... My husband is Christian, but he knows that I've "changed religions" and since I haven't really defined what my "religion" is, he pretty much just ignores any reference I make to it... I have an altar setup (though I haven't used it in quite a long time) and I always refer to it as my "special place" ... It's behind a curtain, in a corner of our bedroom, so it's "out of the way" where he won't have to deal with it... I wear my Bast pendant constantly, but under/inside my shirt... I sometimes worry if I accidentally forget it on the nightstand or somewhere... I know I would be heartbroken if I ever lost it!

My mother knows & my brother knows... my brother is of a Pagan-flavor of spirituality, though I'm not sure which... and of course I have many online friends who know... I have my "religion" as "Pagan" on Facebook, but I doubt anyone ever really looks at the "Info" page for a person's profile - it's mostly all about the "Wall" ...

My father doesn't know, but he does know that I disagree with him on MANY topics of discussion when it comes to religion (and politics)... I actually had to hang-up on him one time when we were talking on the phone because he kept trying to shove his beliefs down my throat and wouldn't accept the fact that I believe in something different - his way is the "only" way and his Bible is the only "truth" out there... we've patched things up a bit, and anytime he starts to mention anything religious, I try to steer the conversation toward something else...

My husband's family doesn't know, and I can only imagine how difficult life would be if they did find out - they are very Christian/Methodist and over Christmas I heard that one of hubby's uncles gave a sermon at their church... though there are a few gay men in the family and they are completely accepted, I don't know how accepting they would be when it comes to a difference of religion...

Also, my boss and his family are Jewish, and they still think I am Christian... even though I have a picture of Bast and the Wheel of the Year up on the wall by my desk... the boss is very passive aggressive and intimidates me a LOT... I don't think I'll ever come completely out of the closet around them...

I'm actually considering creating another account on Facebook for my "Pagan" side... but I'd want to use a name other than my birth-name... considering choosing a "Pagan" name... we'll see how that goes...
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VenusInFurs

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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #20 on: January 12, 2010, 05:56:25 PM »

Since I last posted in here, I'm actually pretty much all out now.  I get excited about spirituality sometimes and I just have to talk about it.  Turns out everyone is supportive, but no one cares, in that they don't think it's anything to make news about or judge me negatively on.  The response has generally been 'ya, that sounds like something you'd be into.'
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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #21 on: January 19, 2010, 09:00:26 PM »

Like some of you here, I am very open about my beliefs to those that know and ask.  I figure if you want me to be part of your world, then you should expect to be part of mine.

I refuse to let my family or anyone else crap on me.  I did that for way too many years.  When you are as old as I am (soon  to be 53), you somehow earn the right to do and say and believe what you want and smack a few people up side the head now and again for getting all crappy on you.  Ya know? 
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Re: Half and Half
« Reply #22 on: January 21, 2010, 11:41:09 AM »

I don't hide my beliefs, but I don't broadcast them either. If someone asks questions about my pagan beliefs, and they seem genuinely interested in knowing/understanding something about me, then I gladly share that part of myself with them. I mainly ignore those that are trying to provoke me or be spiteful, and most people don't ask and I don't tell. My husband knows and supports me whole-heartedly, and as far as I'm concerned, little else matters.
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